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EVAfrommexico
Mexico

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| 12:53 PM Jun 18 2017

WobblyJoe

United States

“Maybe few questions that cannot be answered, because they are over our capabilities, like the nature of God.
Asking is something allowed in Islam.”
The exact same thing is true of Christianity also.
The priest who either would not or could not answer her questions was either incompetent or lazy or evil.
“these basics are discussed almost by religious people who seek to get deep knowledge of these beliefs and have capabilities to understand, analyze and develop these thoughts.”
We do this also to deepen our understanding, and not to establish the truth of the belief.
The same as you guys do.

| 12:48 PM Jun 18 2017

WobblyJoe

United States

Hamid,
This discussion started with:
” in Islam everything is clear. No doubts, no dogmas. no twisted.”
This sparked a discussion of the meaning of “dogma” and my declaration that ISIS twists the meanings of the teachings of Islam to their own evil. Am I wrong?
Eva says “Well, there are many ppl who twist the real meaning of Islam, some of them do it for power, economical or political reasons, but, as I said before: Allah (SWT) don’t comand us to be evil.”
Eva understands what I meant.
Evil people twist the scriptures of all religions.
What we were having trouble with was that all religions have dogma.
That she has no doubts was never under discussion.

| 06:05 AM Jun 18 2017

WobblyJoe

United States

Hello Hamid!
I think you are also mistaken on the meaning.
It has nothing to do with any religion, it describes the parts of the religion that all members of that religion must believe.
Believe already, not still question. If they question, they do not believe.
All religions have dogma. Otherwise they have no beliefs that must be believed.
Which religion has no beliefs which it’s members must believe or they are not members?
I’ve never heard of one.
This is not about Islam, or any book faith, it’s just as true for Hindu’s, Buddhists, and everyone else who believes in something.
It doesn’t even have to be a religion, the undeniable (to it’s followers) part of any belief system is that beliefs’ “dogma”.
Every belief system has dogma.
I hope you’ve read Eva’s testimony. It speaks well of Islam.

| 07:02 PM Jun 17 2017

WobblyJoe

United States

“The concept of “dogma” does not appear in the Qur’an”
Maybe because Dogma is being used as an English word, and English wasn’t really a language when the Qur’an was written.
The concept doesn’t appear in any scriptures, its a description of beliefs, not the beliefs.

| 06:55 PM Jun 17 2017

WobblyJoe

United States

What a beautiful testimony and you have answered my question.
I’m old. I’m not sure there is a word for your Muslima. She has done as could only be done in person in my youth. If she had gone to your lands she would have been a “missionary”, if you had gone to her she would have “witnessed her faith to you”, but I really don’t know of any word from someone who does this online!
The world changed faster than the language did.
My problem with the Dogma part was babbling too much!
I should have just used the summary since that was short.
““The foundations of a dogma ARE NOT SUBJECT TO A DISCUSSION OR QUESTIONING, its truth is unquestionable, and unobjectionable, EVEN IF IT IS UNDERSTABLE OR NOT.””
1. Not subject to a discussion or questioning…
If you are an actual Muslim, you will not discuss or question IF the prophet was a prophet or IF the Koran is inspired. Those who still have those questions are not yet “Muslims”.
Muslims believe, as you believe, in the prophet and the Koran and do not waste time questioning or discussing something they already believe.
2. Its truth is unquestionable, and unobjectionable….
There is nothing questionable or unobjectionable in your belief in Islam. You do not question or object to it’s truth, if you did, you would not be a “Muslim”. Muslims may question the succession of the prophet, but no Muslim questions the prophet or the Koran. Those who do are not Muslims yet.
3. EVEN IF IT IS UNDERSTABLE OR NOT
You understand Islamic dogma, the priest either did not understand Catholic dogma or was too lazy and incompetent to teach you.
Dogma is not an insult against a religion, it’s a description of the beliefs that MUST be believed in order to be a member.

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